The Ryan Adams allegations are the tip of an indie-music iceberg

[Philip]

Yup.

Some of my favourite musicians were/are areseholes.

Still, not that he's a fav, but Gary Glitter mega catchy hits sure have been seriously tainted by his life choices. That's sad!

But, here I am still A Rolling Stones fan despite some well known and I think most likely not so well known seriously iffy goings on by that bunch.

Humans are weird, and hypocrites too.

Who's like us?

[vanguard]

Taken on the whole, men suck a lot more than women. Naturally, the gender that gets blasted with testosterone, patriarchy dogma, alpha male romance, provider instinct, generational oppressor narrative, etc. is gonna produce a lot of unthinking, selfish, regressive twats running around.

From female genital mutilation, "hysteria," rape culture, sex trafficking, to your everyday slut shaming, cat calling, objectification, etc., women have been steeped in essentially the opposite narrative of men.

As long as patriarchy rules us all, this shit will continue. The purer the patriarch, the bigger the asshole.

Having said all that, condemning art on account of the artist is an awful lot like condemning Walmart on moral grounds while shopping at untold other capitalist nightmare corporations. It starts to look at awful lot like puritanical sanctimony.

To come out of this, as a consumer of media, with your hands clean, you'd have to toss out everything from Mozart to Beatles, Joyce to Hemingway, Picasso to . . . et al.

Maybe the best we dudes can do is to just be better dudes in daily life: stop man-spreading, objectifying, cat calling, etc. while leaving moral cleansing crusades to the
to the crazy religious nuts.

Of course, I'm totally mansplaining at this moment, from the absurd platform of the middle-class straight white American male. I've already inherited the kingdom and its spoils, who am I to explain how it's busted?

[jagermonster]

Taken on the whole, men suck a lot more than women. Naturally, the gender that gets blasted with testosterone, patriarchy dogma, alpha male romance, provider instinct, generational oppressor narrative, etc. is gonna produce a lot of unthinking, selfish, regressive twats running around.

From female genital mutilation, "hysteria," rape culture, sex trafficking, to your everyday slut shaming, cat calling, objectification, etc., women have been steeped in essentially the opposite narrative of men.

As long as patriarchy rules us all, this shit will continue. The purer the patriarch, the bigger the asshole.

Having said all that, condemning art on account of the artist is an awful lot like condemning Walmart on moral grounds while shopping at untold other capitalist nightmare corporations. It starts to look at awful lot like puritanical sanctimony.

To come out of this, as a consumer of media, with your hands clean, you'd have to toss out everything from Mozart to Beatles, Joyce to Hemingway, Picasso to . . . et al.

Maybe the best we dudes can do is to just be better dudes in daily life: stop man-spreading, objectifying, cat calling, etc. while leaving moral cleansing crusades to the
to the crazy religious nuts.

Of course, I'm totally mansplaining at this moment, from the absurd platform of the middle-class straight white American male. I've already inherited the kingdom and its spoils, who am I to explain how it's busted?

Well said and something, that if internalized, shall make us a more upright society.

[Zacharia Matilda]

More upright, and, hopefully, more erect.

[redeyeflight]

Look no further than the current American president to find out that men in power more often than not abuse it on women. Twee indie rockers can too. Ryan Adams is of course the tip of the iceberg. Just as Louis CK is for comedy and Harvey Weinstein is for the film industry, etc, etc. It's going to take a massive cultural shift for men to stop thinking they can get away with misconduct towards women, and for women to feel like they have no recourse for combatting it. Unfortunately if we as a men don't take a stand and get rid of the "separate the art from the artist" mentality it helps people like Ryan Adams get away with the bullshit they've been pulling their entire careers. We live in a society where you vote with your dollar. If we continue to support artists who's art may in fact be good (and for the record I am not, nor have I ever been a Ryan Adams fan) but who's personal life is evil then we not so silently support that artist in whatever conduct they continue to commit.

[redeyeflight]

and an addendum to this, I don't mean for this to come off as combative towards folks who have supported the art before artist mentality. I loved Louis CK. I loved many of the films Harvey Weinstein was a part of. Hell, I loved a bunch of R. Kelly songs. That's always an issue of what to do when an artist who you admire turns out to be a shitbag. The struggle comes with continuation of support when an artist you know to have acted wrongly, time and time again. While they may have made some great work, and you can still continue to admire it, there is plenty of amazing art created by amazing artists who are amazing, and good people that its just not worth it IMO.

[2guests]

...men in power more often than not abuse it on women.

How did you quantify that "men in power are more often than not abuse it on women." Could there be a chance that a woman could do the same or be equally involved?"

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[so&so]

^ Sure, women could abuse power, but most of us live in partiarchal societies so that informs the influence and dynamic of power. In turn, when that power is abused it is more often than not by men toward women.

[2guests]

I wonder how the men against woman count is determined to be the highest factor? What does the phrase "serial homosexual abuse" mean?

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[so&so]

Probably because the percentage of women identified humans who experience gender based discrimination/violence/manipulation/abuse is higher than the other straws you're grasping at.