Fake?

[Nick]

To the point of informing the scammers, the wealth of information and imagery that exists on this site/forum and elsewhere should have already informed scammers enough to make an aesthetic and craft accurate fake.

Entire books have been written about 1958 sunburst Les Pauls, and yet crafting the perfect fake apparently still relies on insider knowledge, which is kept under wraps.

An open discussion about pedal subtleties is noble, and it might help one or two people to exercise more caution before pulling the trigger, but it only takes one victim for the scam to be worthwhile. As long as these items command such crazy prices, the dodgy shit will sadly persist.

[Bigfoot2000]

To the point of informing the scammers, the wealth of information and imagery that exists on this site/forum and elsewhere should have already informed scammers enough to make an aesthetic and craft accurate fake.

Tend to agree with this.

[so&so]

I agree that scams will persist, but I will always disagree that the open sharing of information is a place of shame in the scenario.

There isn’t anything secretive about D*A*M pedals; craftsmanship and attention to detail are what set them apart. Very often the Captain lists the graphic process and components in the release info.

To your Les Paul example, I think that gray area/mystery is just as much an aid to a scammer as the information would be.

[Nick]

There isn’t anything secretive about D*A*M pedals; craftsmanship and attention to detail are what set them apart. Very often the Captain lists the graphic process and components in the release info.

But the number of D*A*M pedals that have been built over almost two decades(?!) has to be in the tens of thousands by now, and it is an inherent quality of a boutique product for examples of the same model to differ from one to another. Creating an absolutely perfect counterfeit is an extremely sophisticated job, whether it's a stompbox or a Picasso.

There's no real solution to this problem, but know that the fakery and the general dealer-surreptitiousness isn't something that's new to our community here. Sharing of sensitive information regarding this stuff does happen, but it happens in a controlled manner. I've been helped out in the past by various of the sharp-eyed nerds on this forum, and I've also advised others about whether a bargain vintage pedal might be too good to be true. Through the channels on social media, and of course with this forum, there are already mechanisms in place to help uninformed buyers navigate what can sometimes be a bit of a minefield. People don't even have to email Dave or Steve to get a solid answer. I won't go so far as to say that the bl00z lawyers who impulse-buy £1000 stompboxes without doing some homework deserve what they get, but I don't agree with appeasing them with some sort of widely publicised list of 'tells' on previous fakes (which won't necessarily even be relevant) when this runs a risk of spoiling the entire stompbox scene for everybody else.

And I really do believe that this is a valid concern, as dramatic as it sounds! Over the years there have been at least three(!) reasonably high-profile people/collectors from this forum that have been burned with counterfeit vintage pedals, and the only reason why they have been mostly able to recover from it (and not repeat the mistake) is thanks to private insight & advice from other members of this community. Nevertheless, the people making fake vintage pedals have still gradually improved their efforts, and I'm worried that there will come a time when we can't confidently disprove a pedal anymore, because then there won't be any information for anybody at all. If the demand for 'vintage' D*A*M & Pigdog pedals continues on its current trajectory, then the same thing could happen there.

[jreeves47]

what irks me is this guy immediately went to instagram to try to dump this pedal when his listing got suspended
I wonder if he will out the seller he supposedly got it from...

[so&so]

I totally hear you. I understand the hesitance you’ve expressed and respect that there exists a spectrum of necessary information in any situation. I also recognize the sophistication necessary to produce accurate fakes. It doesn’t appear in the present case that that level was achieved.

I’m not a collector, so vintage stuff is more of a novelty to me. It seems like there is a lot more room for chicanery with vintage pedals. There have been vintage examples on the forum where the circuit looked totally legit to me and other members have pointed out the inconsistencies right away. It’s fascinating stuff and I appreciate them sharing that knowledge.

I don't support people being taken advantage of by any means. Whether that be by flippers, fake pedals, stupid Reverb pricing, or whatever; it’s all the same to me. I think any effort toward building an informed gear community is a reasonable push back.

[peps1]

Think there is something being missed with regards to Dave's builds, Vs Les Pauls, fine Art and vintage pedals. and that's the lack of proprietary parts used.

With a few exceptions, we are talking about a silkscreen & off-the-shelf component, along with very well documented examples. (I'm not saying that is a bad thing, just to be clear. But it is relevant)

I think here bad forgeries are more to do with the lack of skill, rather than being excluded from the guild of esoteric knowledge....at least in this case...

With fake vintage equipment, we normally have absolutes like enclosure measurements and facets that can be dead giveaways (and there I can totally appreciate the gatekeeping).

Guess I just feel like here we are discussing gatekeeping information that is easy to access with Google, a data-sheet and a RAL colour chart.

[Boddah]

Does this look iffy to anyone else?

The writing on the plate doesn’t look legit either, we don’t write our dates that way for a start

https://reverb.com/item/52040279-d-a-m- ... t=52040279

The date is a giveaway, we use day/ month/year.
This one has been written by a yank.
I say it's a fake.